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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5648
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Posted - 2013.07.06 09:56:00 -
[1] - Quote
As a stark reminder, Heavies are not the only people playing this game. There are so many other things to address for every play style of the game just about that just because one class doesn't have any love doesn't really mean it's underpowered or overpowered or not on the minds of the developer for adjustments.
Dust 514 studio is not that large and time spend doing things purposely wrong the first time around is not an efficient use of staff and CCP would rather spend the resources right giving you guys the racial heavies instead 3 new suits that are amarr heavies. After all we seen how CCP has some difficulties pipelining removal of items in the past, no need to get plagued by more script accidents.
As for placeholders, when recolored by their specializations and supposive race they're belonging too you're going to wind up with a bunch of guys looking the same on the battlefield and decisions you're making is getting you killed because you thought you saw the wrong shade of blue or green on a gallente sentinel and threw a flux grenade instead of something more appropriate.
All and all, CPM had pushed for it (months ago) CCP basically said 'No, we rather to it right.' and left it at that while other things got focused on.
Now it may be disheartening to see that there is no mention of new gear suits equipment or vehicles on the 6 month roadmap but CCP Wolfman basically said that new content hasn't been paused for the roadmap so the chances of seeing new things is definitely there when they're ready and it can be anything from new guns to new suits including the missing racials. Afterall things like these can fall under balancing, which itself on the roadmap itself.
And btw, go ahead and continue to sell your fantasy CCP hates heavies, you're going to be sorely disappointed. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5648
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 10:01:00 -
[2] - Quote
First Prophet wrote:SoTa_PoP: Ironwolf: I just told you I like hay and corn.
Fix'ed |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5653
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Posted - 2013.07.06 17:59:00 -
[3] - Quote
oso tiburon wrote:oso tiburon wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:As a stark reminder, Heavies are not the only people playing this game. There are so many other things to address for every play style of the game just about that just because one class doesn't have any love doesn't really mean it's underpowered or overpowered or not on the minds of the developer for adjustments.
Dust 514 studio is not that large and time spend doing things purposely wrong the first time around is not an efficient use of staff and CCP would rather spend the resources right giving you guys the racial heavies instead 3 new suits that are amarr heavies. After all we seen how CCP has some difficulties pipelining removal of items in the past, no need to get plagued by more script accidents.
As for placeholders, when recolored by their specializations and supposive race they're belonging too you're going to wind up with a bunch of guys looking the same on the battlefield and decisions you're making is getting you killed because you thought you saw the wrong shade of blue or green on a gallente sentinel and threw a flux grenade expecting a caldari heavy instead of something more appropriate and the time you just wasted got you killed in that engagement.
All and all, CPM had pushed for it (months ago) CCP basically said 'No, we rather to it right.' and left it at that while other things got focused on.
Now it may be disheartening to see that there is no mention of new gear suits equipment or vehicles on the 6 month roadmap but CCP Wolfman basically said that new content hasn't been paused for the roadmap so the chances of seeing new things is definitely there when they're ready and it can be anything from new guns to new suits including the missing racials. Afterall things like these can fall under balancing, which itself on the roadmap itself.
And btw, go ahead and continue to sell your fantasy CCP hates heavies, you're going to be sorely disappointed. ok then why is it all the other classes got scramblers and flaylocks and shield energizers and all different variants and we got .... the commando ... oh and ... yea looking for it ... hold on ... yea nothing and heres and ideal ... gallente heavys = blue ok minmatar = purple = caldiri = white how hard is that im pretty sure I can go into freaking paint and figure something out . I mean im a novice with the ue3 engine and autodesk maya but damn you guyz have how many devs how many scripters
Traditionally Gallente Green Caldari Blue Minmatar Red Amarr Gold/Yellow
Sentinels are Olive Green, Commandos are Maroon Red, and Prototypes are black.
The when combined under environmental light the shades can be close enough to be confusing. They're going have to go the more obnoxious spectrum of the color pallet in order to get the visual advertisment going. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5653
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 18:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
Overall doing placeholders would be like painting and repairing siding on a house before tearing it down and going in and replacing the siding with bricks.
It's more work for what it is not worth. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5653
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 18:37:00 -
[5] - Quote
Superhero Rawdon wrote:wut in the blue **** (see wut i did there?) do colors have to do with ANYTHING?????
thats got to b the flakiest cop-out BS excuse ive heard for retardation ive ever heard
and that comes with a big fat DERP!!!
give us our damn racial suits already
Less about colors more about shapes advertising what you are and what you are doing and what threats you are likely mostly going to provide. Color is typically the worst advertiser in Dust 514 and when you start throwing in adaptive colors or custom colors well the whole idea goes out the window of using recolors.
Also in better design you wouldn't just be a heavy player but a specific race's heavy, there are quite a few assaults who only identify themselves as one race just right now you guys are lacking some choices however, and despite if given a second option you guys would still be undervalued for having a crappy HMG, being slow as molasses, and not enough utilization of what extremely few slots you guys get to be topped off with an entirely effing useless skill for a weapon that doesn't exist yet. I rather get these fixed and addressed. So when they finally do add a second, third or fourth option you won't be sitting there antagonizing as to why all four races heavies are gawd awful. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5654
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Posted - 2013.07.06 21:17:00 -
[6] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:SoTa PoP wrote:From IronWolfSaber on IRC: Quote:cost effort would be too high to use place holders
GG Heavies - we cost too much for them to care about. Anyone that uses Light frame suits could make the same argument, really. at least they have a choice between the 2
and both choices are considered bad atm which is probably the other point I am trying to drive home.
I mean what if they got all four races dropships in and fixed nothing else? Heavies are in a very similar position.
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5656
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Posted - 2013.07.06 21:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:SoTa PoP wrote:They don't agree and flat out call me stupid.
I'm having trouble grasping the point of the CPM, honestly. CCP doesn't even know what goes out in their own patches, why exactly do we need a middle group to speak for us when we don't really even have much of a say over what they speak about? O.o
Actually we told SoTa to go to bed since he was drunk. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5656
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 21:22:00 -
[8] - Quote
SoTa PoP wrote:
Even if our variants are bad - at least we'd have a choice... and a choice between shield tanking and armor tanking would be great... and honestly - fair.
Not really I hardly notice the difference when forge gunning an armor drop ship or a shield dropship. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5656
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Posted - 2013.07.06 21:26:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ninjanomyx wrote: OMFG..........IWS just QUIT already. You are so f***ing irrelevant it actually makes me physically ill everytime you type/speak. You aren't a presence ingame, you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to just about ANYTHING, and what little "Information" you provide is often misinformation & regurgitated misdirection. You are CCPs f***ing lap dog..... Whatever BS PR Spindig they fecal toss your way you immediately gobble it down & drool out the leftovers for the "Community".
From a Tactical Standpoint you often only see the Size/Shape of the Avatar before an Engagement. You then decide to Shoot or Run based upon the presented Scenario. The Color of the Suit & details of the "Skin" are often the last thing on your mind in a heated firefight, you simply Fight or Flight. And if you had enough time to stare at the Nipple Rings or Crotch Curvature of a Dropsuit for "Tactical Purposes" then you probably had enough time to ADS & read the Analysis/Scan of the ACTUAL DATA, which is far more informative as it contains all of the Data you need at a glance (& is extremely simple to add in).
Placeholders are hardly expensive.... You slap a Color (Or don't, who cares) on a Dural Suit & give it Stats & Slots, a Name, & an Skill Node to sink SP into & viola, new f***ing Dropsuits. Modeling is not needed so the Art Department can take their sweet ass time playing Dress-up or making New Models for New Content (MTAC, Jet, etc) & then play the Crayola Game w/ the Skins afterwards. I mean....are you seriously this dunce & blind of a Fanboy Pet that you defend this POS excuse??? I take it as yes....you are.
Placeholders allow for there to be room to breathe while the Community enjoys Critiquing & Metagaming the **** out of their new toys. Stat Balancing can be done @ a proper pace w/ more Community Involvement as we will have gained experience with the Synergies berween the Variants, thus allowing better informed Balancing Discussions at an accelerated pace. What we have now is a Logistical mess with no Balance while slow trickles of New Suits are thrown into the mix. Commando Suit, Pilot Suit, Weapons, hell even Modules & Equipment that are NEW are being introduced.....yet the Core Variants are left on the backburner.
This now excessively elongates the Balancing Duration & forces a significant chunk of the already burnt-out Community to remain Spec'd into something that is so far off of their chosen Career Path only to retain relevance on the Battlefield. Anyone who hoardes SP for 3 Years, remaining at the bottom of the "Food Chain" & being barred from Competitive Play, still clinging onto "Hope" as they live to be PUBstomped while eagerly awaiting their desired Fitting to be made.....is a Masochistic Blind Fanboy Freerunner. So not only do these ignoramus not contribute to the Developers/Producers/Directors/Etc. (& if they do...they are further gone mentally for Paying to Wait). they also attemp to derail Valuable Discussions by claiming those who don't follow their Mantra of what they call "Patience" to be deserving of wasting their SP.
So not only will introducing Placeholders, promptly followed by a Respec, be significantly more Cost Effective in the long run.....it also frees up Developmental Effort/Time that may further focus on Core & Balancing, allows a feeling of Near-Completion/Variety which boosts Community Morale & Player Retension, prevents a feeling of immediate need for Respec & Reinbursement in the future, & generally enables more valuable Well-Informed Discussions now rather than "SoonGäó". But what the hell do I know.....I haven't had my nasal cavity so far up the rectal orifice that I can smell last week's dinner :P
What part of 'CPM already tried and failed to get placeholders done months ago' did you not understand? |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5658
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Posted - 2013.07.06 21:34:00 -
[10] - Quote
Yeah I wished they would swap sentinel and commando suit bonuses they seem to fit each other a hell lot better. |
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5661
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Posted - 2013.07.06 22:35:00 -
[11] - Quote
SoTa PoP wrote:So let me get this straight:
CPM Tried to get place-holders - got told to eff off - so stopped bringing it up? Regardless of CCP's position it should be hammered the importance of those place holders. You fail as our reps when you give into CCP's fail-logic of "Too much work and money."
I have an idea - take away all the suits variants and put them in the same boat as heavy and watch them be humbled by "Sorry too cost effective" and "Sorry - we don't think it would balance current game."
I'm sure people will just throw money left and right at CCP over it.
Well CPM knows when and when not to push after all we're not designers, business manager nor their bosses.
While the CPM does have a great deal of influence on some thing for example, CPM Kain and CPM Nova Knife did a lot of pushing on one subject and actually got a change through next week.
There are topic and issues which CCP does have the right to put their foot down and basically tell us rather not. For example I suggested a vehicle control scheme which was shot down near instantly with a fairly good reason and well I am not going to push that subject again because it would be a waste of time and its rather marginal.
Like I said if I had to pick between fighting for place holes and fighting for new suits I rather fight for getting new heavy suits out. Because CCP cannot stomp on that at all because its on their to do list. Where as placeholders have been stomped down on and I am not willing to refight that. Now if CCP said like we're getting racial MMCs out before racial heavies I would certainly throw a tantrum then as MCCs are not gameplay objects yet.
I mean I am not sure where the three eye'd Gallente Heavy rumor came from as I haven't seen it on any of the Dev postings but if its true then more power to you. Just because the 6 month road map you guys saw is devoid of any 'content' you have to remember that these goals are very free form and can and will include content so on the balance bullet point new suits may be required to achieve that. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5668
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 23:13:00 -
[12] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Like I said if I had to pick between fighting for placeholders or fighting for new suits I rather fight for getting new heavy suits out. Because CCP cannot stomp on that at all because it is on their to do list. Where as placeholders have been stomped down on and I am not willing to refight that. Now if CCP said like we're getting racial MMCs out before racial heavies I would certainly throw a tantrum then as MCCs are not gameplay objects yet.
I'd just like to be clear that I don't want placeholders. I want the suits. And if CCP aims to make me wait another half a year to get them, then they best DAMN make sure they refund the racial SP for Heavy and Scout suits when their racial variants are released.
Well I have no idea when the new suits are coming out but love for the Heavies is wanted. I hope it won't come down to waiting six months but whatever happens is going to happen. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5669
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 23:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
Sloth9230 wrote:Changing their colors is expensive? Bro, I could do it on Paint.
Item creation and then removal is probably more expensive. |
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